Dec. 8, 2025
The 3 Biggest Messaging and Engagement Mistakes that Could be Costing You Influence and Results
I see three major mistakes that get made all the time among Nonprofit leaders when they're engaging decisionmakers. These mistakes will invariably cost you influence and results, especially funding results. Now more than ever, especially in this environment, you need both your existing funders and potential funders to be investing in your work at the highest level. But lately, when you go to talk to elected officials or government agency people or foundations, a lot of times you hear t...
I see three major mistakes that get made all the time among Nonprofit leaders when they're engaging decisionmakers. These mistakes will invariably cost you influence and results, especially funding results.
Now more than ever, especially in this environment, you need both your existing funders and potential funders to be investing in your work at the highest level. But lately, when you go to talk to elected officials or government agency people or foundations, a lot of times you hear things like, well, there's not really any money right now. We can't afford it. It's not the right time.
And you start to feel like all the stuff you came to tell them that explains why they need to invest is falling on deaf ears. They listen politely enough, but you can feel the resistance.
And every time you have one of these conversations, your frustration goes up another notch, and your worry level goes up another notch too. 'Cause if we can't break through with these people, if we can't get them to get it, where's the money gonna come from? And then what?
It's tempting to write off those decisionmakers or get mad at them. But if we really want their investment, we have to find a way in. If they're not getting the most essential pieces of what you do and the problem you solve, and the value that solution has, the impact that it makes, and the level of investment that is necessary in order to buy that impact.
If they're not getting all of that, and not feeling motivated to find a way to make that investment. Then somewhere your messaging and engagement are not doing as good a job for you as they could.
Chances are you may be making one or more of three very common and costly mistakes.
In this episode, we share:
- Why most introductions create distance and disengagement
- How to change up your introduction to pull decisonmakers in and make them want to know more
- How to weave points of alignment and relevance throughout the conversation to keep the decisionmaker invested
- The critical reframe you must make to counter decisonmakers’ claims of “there’s not enough money”
- The secret to engaging a decisionmaker around the problems they’re most concerned about
- The most common erroneous assumption we make about why a decisionmaker’s not “getting it,” and how that hurts us
- The times when we’re most vulnerable to the biggest engagement pitfalls, and how to stay alert to those
Ready to take your messaging and engagement skills to the next level? The wait list for my new coaching program is now open. Only 10 Founding Member spots will be available. Claim yours by sending me a message here:
On LinkedIn
Through the Podcast website
WEBVTT
00:00:00.050 --> 00:00:02.720
You're listening to the Nonprofit Power Podcast.
00:00:03.020 --> 00:00:11.330
In today's episode, we share the three biggest mistakes in messaging and engagement that could be costing you influence and results.
00:00:11.660 --> 00:00:12.109
So stay tuned.
00:00:19.274 --> 00:00:28.184
If you wanna have real and powerful influence over the money and policy decisions that impact your organization and the people you serve, then you're in the right place.
00:00:28.785 --> 00:00:41.804
I'm Kath Patrick, and I've helped dozens of progressive Nonprofit leaders take their organizations to new and higher levels of impact and success by building powerful influence with the decision makers that matter.
00:00:42.435 --> 00:00:54.975
It is possible to get a critical mass of the money and policy decision makers in your world to be as invested in your success as you are, to have them seeking you out as an equal partner and to have them.
00:00:55.034 --> 00:00:57.825
Bringing opportunities and resources to you.
00:00:58.424 --> 00:01:00.554
This podcast will help you do just that.
00:01:01.005 --> 00:01:04.034
Welcome to the Nonprofit Power Podcast.
00:01:09.599 --> 00:01:10.307
Hey there folks.
00:01:10.307 --> 00:01:12.376
Welcome to the Nonprofit Power Podcast.
00:01:12.736 --> 00:01:13.966
I'm your host, Kath Patrick.
00:01:14.507 --> 00:01:41.147
I'm so glad you're here for today's episode because I see three major mistakes that get made all the time among Nonprofit leaders when they're engaging decision makers that will invariably cost you influence and results, especially funding results Now more than ever, especially in this environment, you need your existing funders and potential funders both to be investing in your work at the highest level.
00:01:41.572 --> 00:01:53.581
But lately when you go to talk to elected officials or government agency people or foundations, a lot of the times you hear things like, well, there's not really any money right now.
00:01:53.581 --> 00:01:55.022
We can't afford it.
00:01:55.201 --> 00:01:58.501
It's not the right time, blah, blah, blah.
00:01:58.772 --> 00:02:06.421
And you start to feel like all the stuff you came to tell them that explains why they need to invest is falling on deaf ears.
00:02:07.201 --> 00:02:10.861
They listen politely enough, but you can feel the resistance.
00:02:11.401 --> 00:02:19.622
And every time you have one of these conversations, your frustration goes up another notch and your worry level goes up another notch too.
00:02:19.981 --> 00:02:26.651
'Cause if we can't break through with these people, if we can't get them to get it, where's the money gonna come from?
00:02:26.891 --> 00:02:27.611
And then what?
00:02:28.360 --> 00:02:32.319
It's tempting to write off those decision makers or get mad at them.
00:02:33.189 --> 00:02:37.030
But if we really want their investment, we have to find a way in.
00:02:37.563 --> 00:02:51.783
If they're not getting the most essential pieces of what you do and the problem you solve, and the value that solution has, the impact that it makes, and the level of investment that is necessary in order to buy that impact.
00:02:52.342 --> 00:02:53.932
If they're not getting all of that.
00:02:54.337 --> 00:02:58.008
And feeling motivated to find a way to make that investment.
00:02:58.638 --> 00:03:04.578
Then somewhere your messaging and engagement are not doing as good a job for you as they could.
00:03:05.418 --> 00:03:12.057
Chances are you may be making one or more of three very common and costly mistakes.
00:03:14.122 --> 00:03:21.263
What I see a lot of the time is that these mistakes tend to happen as a combination of messaging and engagement.
00:03:21.735 --> 00:03:29.651
And when that's going on, the signs of the mistakes can be subtle at first, but they tend to build on one another during the conversation.
00:03:30.191 --> 00:03:38.409
And somewhere along the way you realize they're not as engaged as you want them to be, and your best information isn't landing.
00:03:38.710 --> 00:03:39.879
They're not getting it.
00:03:40.419 --> 00:03:45.760
And that's our number one test for, is the messaging and engagement working well?
00:03:46.270 --> 00:03:48.550
It's, are they getting it or aren't they?
00:03:49.474 --> 00:03:56.557
One of the biggest mistakes that will cost you the most, is really insidious because it doesn't feel like that should be so.
00:03:57.057 --> 00:03:59.518
This mistake could be described in a number of ways.
00:03:59.518 --> 00:04:01.617
You could call it business as usual.
00:04:01.617 --> 00:04:04.448
You could call it doing things the way you've always done them.
00:04:05.078 --> 00:04:08.707
You could call it doing things the way everybody else is doing them.
00:04:09.207 --> 00:04:11.397
Any or all of those things can apply.
00:04:11.728 --> 00:04:18.838
It doesn't really matter which one it is, but it's the business as usual problem that can really cost you.
00:04:19.678 --> 00:04:24.168
The essential mistake is opening with information rather than engagement.
00:04:25.038 --> 00:04:32.209
How many times have you walked into a meeting with a decision maker and just kind of launched into your normal introductory spiel?
00:04:32.238 --> 00:04:32.569
Right?
00:04:32.569 --> 00:04:33.619
Introduce yourself.
00:04:33.678 --> 00:04:35.778
If you've brought anyone with you, you introduce them.
00:04:35.988 --> 00:04:42.584
And then you go into kind of the background paragraph or two about what you do, who you help, how many people you serve and so on.
00:04:43.360 --> 00:04:48.341
And that's really comfortable and familiar'cause you've done it a million times.
00:04:48.341 --> 00:04:53.189
It feels like a good idea because it's helping you relax.
00:04:53.189 --> 00:05:01.620
It's helping you get into the meeting and kind of get your rhythm going, get in the flow of talking to this particular decision maker.
00:05:01.889 --> 00:05:06.711
Especially if there's anything about this conversation that's feeling maybe a little stressful going in.
00:05:07.341 --> 00:05:23.163
It's very natural to wanna focus on some very comfortable and familiar messaging that you've said a million times so you don't have to think too hard about it, and that you can kind of use that opportunity to breathe and relax into the flow of the conversation.
00:05:23.884 --> 00:05:26.673
So that seems like a totally reasonable thing to do.
00:05:27.297 --> 00:05:28.257
Here's the problem.
00:05:28.757 --> 00:05:30.617
There's nothing about that that's engaging.
00:05:31.117 --> 00:05:37.177
How many times have you sat through somebody else's introduction that kind of goes on for a paragraph or two.
00:05:37.607 --> 00:05:41.507
Hopefully you're focused on trying to remember their name and the organization they're from.
00:05:41.716 --> 00:05:46.367
But after that, you know, unless it's super interesting, your mind's probably wandering.
00:05:46.367 --> 00:05:51.302
You're maybe thinking about the next thing you need to say, or wondering where this is going or whatever.
00:05:51.543 --> 00:05:52.862
But you're not engaged.
00:05:53.418 --> 00:05:57.468
At the very best, you are politely, but passively listening.
00:05:58.211 --> 00:06:02.232
Is that really what you want from a decision maker is polite, passive, listening?
00:06:02.891 --> 00:06:05.831
We want them engaged from the very beginning.
00:06:06.701 --> 00:06:10.091
So if we want that, we can't do business as usual.
00:06:10.591 --> 00:06:17.252
And you know, we think that it doesn't matter if we start out with the boring basics,'cause like everybody understands that's how it goes.
00:06:17.252 --> 00:06:20.461
And you have to get through that part before you get to the interesting stuff.
00:06:21.132 --> 00:06:22.752
I invite you to rethink that.
00:06:23.427 --> 00:06:25.875
Because think about, what's gonna engage you?
00:06:26.355 --> 00:06:30.555
If somebody's yammering at you about what their organization does and who they help and blah, blah, blah.
00:06:31.103 --> 00:06:36.533
And especially if they're doing it in a way that you can tell, they've said this a kabillion times before.
00:06:36.983 --> 00:06:39.593
How closely are you listening to that quite honestly?
00:06:40.163 --> 00:06:43.973
I can promise you that decision makers tend not to listen super closely to that.
00:06:44.293 --> 00:06:45.372
Polite listening, yes.
00:06:45.372 --> 00:06:46.692
But are they really engaging?
00:06:46.783 --> 00:06:47.083
No.
00:06:47.882 --> 00:06:57.052
And the problem is that, it actually does matter if we start out with those boring basics, because boring basics create distance.
00:06:57.742 --> 00:06:59.182
They create disengagement.
00:06:59.483 --> 00:07:00.173
You've seen this.
00:07:00.173 --> 00:07:03.773
Decision makers are already somewhat predisposed to be disengaged.
00:07:04.512 --> 00:07:05.923
So we have to change that.
00:07:06.766 --> 00:07:09.646
Now, you may not be able to escape introductions.
00:07:09.797 --> 00:07:14.146
If you've not met with this person before, or if some in your group have not met with them before.
00:07:14.627 --> 00:07:18.036
They do need to know who's in the room, so you have to go ahead and do that.
00:07:18.595 --> 00:07:20.605
But even with that simple thing.
00:07:21.105 --> 00:07:26.444
Which I know it's so tempting to just be rote with that and just be like, yep, i'm Suzy Q.
00:07:26.475 --> 00:07:31.701
I'm the CEO of X, Y, Z organization, and we do this, that, and the other.
00:07:32.495 --> 00:07:36.785
Instead of doing it the way you've always done it and the way everybody else is doing it.
00:07:37.309 --> 00:07:45.899
Try doing it in a way that helps you stand out, that helps you grab the decision maker's attention from the very first words outta your mouth.
00:07:46.673 --> 00:08:08.963
So instead of saying, I'm Suzy Q, I'm the CEO of X, Y, Z organization, and we do blah, blah, blah, you could say, i'm Suzy Q and I'm lucky enough to be the CEO of the one organization in this community that transforms, fill in the blank, whatever the impact is you make on the people you serve.
00:08:09.463 --> 00:08:14.252
And don't be afraid to make your organization distinct in that process.
00:08:14.882 --> 00:08:18.122
The name of your organization doesn't necessarily mean anything to them.
00:08:18.543 --> 00:08:23.367
Unless they know you really well already, in which case you're not having an introductory conversation.
00:08:24.117 --> 00:08:25.026
But if they don't know that.
00:08:25.526 --> 00:08:30.987
Or even if they think they do, even if they think they know what you do, and this happens a lot by the way.
00:08:31.497 --> 00:08:32.756
Oh yeah, I know.
00:08:32.756 --> 00:08:34.256
X, Y, Z organization.
00:08:34.527 --> 00:08:35.726
They work on.
00:08:35.907 --> 00:08:40.976
And then they'll say something and it's like kind of tangentially related to what you do.
00:08:41.397 --> 00:08:50.442
But it is so far from understanding the depth of the problems you solve and the depth of the impact you make, that it's kind of horrifying.
00:08:50.892 --> 00:08:55.812
So even when they think they know your organization, they probably don't unless they've actually worked with you.
00:08:56.711 --> 00:09:01.981
So yeah, you need to say the name of the organization, but you don't need to say it first.
00:09:02.461 --> 00:09:14.408
Lead with the impact and say, I'm lucky enough to be the CEO of an organization that is unique in this community, in the way that we make a powerful impact on whoever you serve.
00:09:14.977 --> 00:09:17.918
And we transform their lives in X, Y, Z ways.
00:09:18.458 --> 00:09:20.678
And you get that in there right at the beginning.
00:09:21.033 --> 00:09:22.823
Now you're sparking curiosity.
00:09:22.823 --> 00:09:26.364
Now you're sparking, oh wait, hey, maybe I should pay attention to this.
00:09:26.413 --> 00:09:31.134
If they're making a big impact in the community and they're unique in some way, I might wanna know about that.
00:09:31.953 --> 00:09:42.864
What we have to realize is that each time you open your mouth, it's a tiny opportunity to build engagement, to build interest, to build curiosity.
00:09:43.364 --> 00:09:52.904
It's also, each time you open your mouth, an opportunity to have them push away a little bit, to have them disengage just a little bit more.
00:09:53.715 --> 00:10:01.658
So, of course, the choice we wanna make is, each time we open our mouth, we wanna make sure we're doing the engaging thing.
00:10:01.658 --> 00:10:05.938
And that we're using the messaging elements that are going to help cause that engagement.
00:10:06.785 --> 00:10:16.494
Another mistake that I see happen a lot is waiting too long in the conversation to show alignment and relevance to the things that they care about.
00:10:16.994 --> 00:10:27.070
And a lot of times I'll see Nonprofit leaders give their whole spiel and then at the end they'll say, and this is how that's all aligned with the the stuff that you care about.
00:10:27.570 --> 00:10:38.193
You can imagine that when we do that, we're leaving a big element of influence on the table for most of the conversation when we could be leveraging it at every moment.
00:10:38.977 --> 00:10:49.727
The thing is that a lot of times, even when we do get around to highlighting alignment and relevance, we tend to do it in kind of dry factual ways.
00:10:50.538 --> 00:10:58.977
And just like all our other messaging, if we want it to engage, we need to evoke emotion, we need to involve the senses.
00:10:59.128 --> 00:11:02.538
We need to inspire curiosity and thought.
00:11:02.807 --> 00:11:05.508
We need to do all the stuff we need to do with all the rest of our messaging.
00:11:06.561 --> 00:11:12.140
It's not that we do that for part of it, like for the client story, and then we don't do that for all the other.
00:11:12.321 --> 00:11:13.520
We do it for everything.
00:11:14.248 --> 00:11:19.714
So really, points of alignment and relevance between your stuff and the decision-maker's.
00:11:19.714 --> 00:11:24.953
Interests, ideally are being woven in from the very beginning of the conversation.
00:11:25.453 --> 00:11:29.014
And the more you can incorporate points of relevance, the better.
00:11:29.600 --> 00:11:34.995
It's not just, you know, I'll take a super common example'cause it's really simple and happens a lot.
00:11:35.525 --> 00:11:37.985
You've got somebody who is very fiscally conservative.
00:11:38.035 --> 00:11:41.125
Or maybe they're not even fiscally conservative, but they're worried about the budget.
00:11:41.711 --> 00:11:44.846
And you're asking them to make a bigger investment.
00:11:45.346 --> 00:11:49.517
So you've already planned, you're gonna come in and you're gonna hit hard on the ROI data.
00:11:49.846 --> 00:11:56.417
And you're gonna talk to them about the ripple effects you make and how that offsets other costs, other outlays, et cetera.
00:11:56.417 --> 00:11:58.307
You've put together that rationale.
00:11:58.817 --> 00:11:59.116
Right.
00:11:59.447 --> 00:12:00.047
So that's good.
00:12:00.047 --> 00:12:01.397
You want that, you need that.
00:12:01.397 --> 00:12:05.735
That's the underpinning of the factual part of your messaging.
00:12:06.634 --> 00:12:11.664
But how we roll that out, how we use that in conversation, really matters.
00:12:12.648 --> 00:12:28.831
One of the most effective ways to do that is to think of, ideally before the meeting, all the different ways in which any aspect of your stuff is relevant to any aspect of things they care about.
00:12:29.466 --> 00:12:33.267
And you're pulling up those points of relevance at every opportunity.
00:12:33.928 --> 00:12:36.658
Let me take that same example and build that out a little bit.
00:12:37.158 --> 00:12:46.541
We need to bring to life for them the full experience of being in the problem that they're in, that is causing there to be alignment.
00:12:46.806 --> 00:12:52.255
Or being in the experience of not having the thing that they want, that is the ultimate outcome they're after, whatever it is.
00:12:52.816 --> 00:13:03.255
Or maybe it's a positive experience of, they have a big ambition to make something great happen, and your stuff is aligned in some way.
00:13:03.525 --> 00:13:04.186
Either way.
00:13:04.365 --> 00:13:07.725
But a lot of times it's really about them being in a problem.
00:13:08.176 --> 00:13:10.456
Like there's not enough money in the budget.
00:13:10.966 --> 00:13:12.316
And they're really stressed.
00:13:12.395 --> 00:13:23.635
Elected officials right now, at every level of government, but particularly state and local governments are just really stressed out about the fact that revenue is down in a lot of places.
00:13:24.385 --> 00:13:31.255
And their standard playbook for what you do when you have a shortfall in revenue is one of two things.
00:13:31.375 --> 00:13:37.062
You either raise taxes, you increase the revenue, or you reduce expenses.
00:13:37.611 --> 00:13:41.422
And there's already a critical flaw in that thinking.
00:13:41.721 --> 00:13:54.461
There's actually several, but the one that is the most dangerous to you is if you allow them to view investment in your program as an expense, versus an investment.
00:13:54.711 --> 00:13:56.871
That's a critical reframe that has to happen.
00:13:56.961 --> 00:14:03.081
Because as long as they think of you as an outlay, like, oh, it's a thing we have to spend money on, and it just sort of goes away.
00:14:03.081 --> 00:14:06.442
We spend on it and it's gone, and there's not really a return.
00:14:06.942 --> 00:14:12.611
If you have any ROI data or framing at all, which I hope you do.
00:14:13.162 --> 00:14:17.331
Then you're talking to them about the ways in which this is an investment.
00:14:17.971 --> 00:14:21.991
But let's just bring this back'cause it's going a little couple different places here.
00:14:22.491 --> 00:14:25.111
If they're in the problem of from their perspective.
00:14:25.361 --> 00:14:28.511
The way they would describe the problem is there's not enough money.
00:14:29.032 --> 00:14:32.998
The revenue we have this year is less than the revenue we had last year.
00:14:33.508 --> 00:14:37.975
And our commitments to spend money on stuff hasn't gone down.
00:14:38.475 --> 00:14:40.695
There's still all these things that we need to spend money on.
00:14:41.195 --> 00:14:45.245
That's a very stressful position for them to be in, especially for elected officials.
00:14:45.605 --> 00:14:47.404
Because none of that's popular.
00:14:47.615 --> 00:14:49.835
If they have to raise taxes, that will be unpopular.
00:14:49.955 --> 00:14:53.524
If they have to reduce services, that will be unpopular.
00:14:54.034 --> 00:14:57.544
They're between a rock and a hard place as far as they can see it.
00:14:58.044 --> 00:15:05.154
So one thing for you to do is to think about, what does it feel like to be in that problem?
00:15:05.654 --> 00:15:07.215
How stressful is that?
00:15:07.904 --> 00:15:23.815
Depending on their general political bent, maybe they're somebody who really cares about the broad array of social services and is really torn up, really upset about the possibility that some of those services might have to be cut.
00:15:24.024 --> 00:15:25.554
From the way they're thinking right now.
00:15:25.804 --> 00:15:33.514
At the same time, they're looking at the possibility of trying to raise taxes and realizing how unpopular that would be and how much blowback there would be.
00:15:33.514 --> 00:15:35.615
And that that would be a whole thing.
00:15:35.717 --> 00:15:37.638
That's a very stressful place to be.
00:15:37.937 --> 00:15:46.418
So the more you can acknowledge what that feels like to be in that problem, to talk about some of the stress and the distress.
00:15:46.837 --> 00:15:51.357
If they're worried about possibly having to cut services they really care about and so on.
00:15:51.778 --> 00:15:59.820
To be able to speak to what that feels like and to show them that you get it, you get what they're going through, you understand them.
00:16:00.370 --> 00:16:07.080
And then to be able to talk about how there's actually a third way.
00:16:07.580 --> 00:16:13.279
That it's not just raise more revenue or reduce expenses.
00:16:13.779 --> 00:16:16.720
The third option is to invest wisely.
00:16:17.220 --> 00:16:31.176
And when you invest wisely in a program or service that actually reduces expenses somewhere else on the ledger, that that becomes a much more productive and interesting investment.
00:16:31.176 --> 00:16:41.750
That actually starts to not only still be able to carry out the important services, but actually to reduce the outlay in some other places.
00:16:42.250 --> 00:16:47.221
Because if you solve the problem, then the continuous outlay goes away.
00:16:48.120 --> 00:17:02.958
So there's a bunch of different ways to talk about that, that are both successful messaging in terms of framing the investment in your work as an investment rather than an expense, which is critical framing always, but especially now.
00:17:03.769 --> 00:17:09.378
But the other piece of it is to not be afraid to spend some time.
00:17:09.469 --> 00:17:14.051
You don't have to go super deep, but to spend some time acknowledging.
00:17:14.321 --> 00:17:18.142
Saying, you know, it's gotta be a really stressful situation for you all.
00:17:18.192 --> 00:17:20.291
You care about social services, if they do.
00:17:20.442 --> 00:17:23.142
Or you can say you care about being fiscally responsible.
00:17:23.172 --> 00:17:24.882
Whatever the thing is that they care about.
00:17:25.182 --> 00:17:28.132
And you've got what feels like an impossible situation.
00:17:28.632 --> 00:17:31.872
And then you can present your solution to their problem.
00:17:32.298 --> 00:17:33.917
Which is the wise investment.
00:17:34.718 --> 00:17:36.157
That's just one example.
00:17:36.843 --> 00:17:43.952
What would happen if you had that strategy lined up, but you waited to lay it out till the end, when you're making your ask?
00:17:44.643 --> 00:17:52.863
How much opportunity for engagement would've been lost And what would happen if you did something different?
00:17:53.397 --> 00:17:59.907
How much more predisposed to take in everything you're saying and to wanna help and wanna invest.
00:18:00.448 --> 00:18:18.137
How much more likely would they be to be saying yes to all of that if you had connected with their emotional experience of the problem very early in the conversation and helped them to see that you've come to help them get out of that very painful problem.
00:18:19.007 --> 00:18:22.750
This applies to whatever the variables are at hand.
00:18:22.750 --> 00:18:24.911
That's just one example that's very common.
00:18:25.615 --> 00:18:36.566
But to acknowledge their emotional experience of the thing that they are either struggling with or that they are hoping to achieve but can't see a way to yet.
00:18:37.162 --> 00:18:46.768
If you just sit with them for a bit and reflect back to them the emotional aspects of that experience, you're gonna connect with them on a whole new level.
00:18:46.768 --> 00:18:50.038
And they're gonna look at you and hear you in a very different way.
00:18:50.538 --> 00:18:57.428
And since we're all about engagement, the more engaged they are, the more of your messaging they take in and retain.
00:18:58.265 --> 00:19:08.519
Now, the third huge super common mistake that I see every single Nonprofit leader do at least once during the time I work with them.
00:19:09.176 --> 00:19:12.287
And that is overreliance on information.
00:19:13.044 --> 00:19:16.086
And I get why leaders do this.
00:19:16.336 --> 00:19:19.037
Part of this is the curse of being the expert.
00:19:19.498 --> 00:19:30.196
We know so much about the work that we do, and the complexity of it and the depth of impact it makes, and the incredible value that that creates and the worth of that investment.
00:19:30.390 --> 00:19:37.462
We get all of that so deeply that when we're talking with a decision maker and they're not getting it.
00:19:37.962 --> 00:19:43.573
We tend to think that the reason they're not getting it, is that we didn't explain it enough.
00:19:43.573 --> 00:19:45.103
We didn't give them enough detail.
00:19:45.153 --> 00:19:45.873
Oh, well wait.
00:19:45.923 --> 00:19:50.272
Maybe I left out the part where this is an important thing they need to know, da, da, da.
00:19:50.542 --> 00:19:51.952
And I'll, I'll put that in.
00:19:51.952 --> 00:19:55.853
I'll give them more data, I'll give them more information, and then they'll get it.
00:19:56.873 --> 00:20:02.920
Once in a blue moon, the problem is actually that they were missing a piece of information.
00:20:02.920 --> 00:20:03.970
That does happen.
00:20:04.661 --> 00:20:15.411
It is possible, and I'm guilty of this on a regular basis, that when we are deeply knowledgeable about something, we'll often make a mental leap and leave others behind when we do that.
00:20:15.861 --> 00:20:20.480
So we need to structure our messaging in a way that has us not doing that.
00:20:21.030 --> 00:20:24.314
But usually that's not really why they're not getting it.
00:20:25.104 --> 00:20:31.731
Usually the reason they're not getting it is that they're not emotionally invested in the stuff.
00:20:32.231 --> 00:20:34.751
They're not listening that hard, so it doesn't matter.
00:20:35.358 --> 00:20:36.348
So here's a question.
00:20:36.499 --> 00:20:49.249
If they're already not listening very hard and you give them more data, more facts, more information, what are the chances that they will listen harder because you're giving them more of the thing they're already not listening to?
00:20:50.377 --> 00:21:10.284
We make the mistake of thinking that decision makers are operating principally from the rational side of the brain, when in fact they're like every other human on the planet and the emotional center is running most of the show Now they will deny that till the cows come home.
00:21:10.959 --> 00:21:12.278
But it doesn't matter.
00:21:12.308 --> 00:21:15.249
They're humans and that's how our brains are wired.
00:21:15.608 --> 00:21:19.565
So the fact is, we must engage the emotions.
00:21:19.565 --> 00:21:22.231
We must engage the whole human.
00:21:22.682 --> 00:21:23.791
We need to connect.
00:21:24.362 --> 00:21:29.059
And we can impart information along the way.
00:21:29.390 --> 00:21:33.554
But even when we're doing that, the best way to do it is to ask questions.
00:21:33.554 --> 00:21:37.592
To invite them to think for themselves about what's the next thing?
00:21:37.855 --> 00:21:42.259
What's the next piece of this logic framework or whatever that you're bringing them along with.
00:21:43.220 --> 00:21:46.950
Ask questions, inspire curiosity, create surprise.
00:21:47.450 --> 00:21:50.339
You can also inspire other emotions.
00:21:50.339 --> 00:21:51.509
You can evoke the senses.
00:21:51.509 --> 00:21:56.659
You can do all the things with different stories, with different pieces of messaging.
00:21:57.290 --> 00:22:03.811
But the deadly mistake is making the assumption that if they're not getting it, that what they need is more information.
00:22:04.749 --> 00:22:06.398
It's almost never true.
00:22:07.199 --> 00:22:10.910
So three big mistakes and what to do instead.
00:22:11.482 --> 00:22:13.227
Let's just recap real briefly.
00:22:13.727 --> 00:22:18.999
Three big mistakes are opening with information rather than engagement.
00:22:19.499 --> 00:22:25.078
Waiting too long in the conversation to show alignment and relevance to the things they care about.
00:22:25.578 --> 00:22:34.884
And relying primarily on information to fill knowledge gaps when the problem is that they're actually just not listening because they're not engaged.
00:22:35.634 --> 00:22:40.454
If you can pay attention to those three major pitfalls and can stay out of them.
00:22:40.923 --> 00:22:47.997
And can instead deliberately craft your messaging and engagement strategy to fix those three pieces.
00:22:48.497 --> 00:22:52.997
The level of engagement that you see from decision makers will go up very quickly.
00:22:53.497 --> 00:23:00.217
And if you're already doing this most of the time, pay attention to where you tend to fall back into the pitfalls.
00:23:00.636 --> 00:23:06.846
Chances are it's when you're either super pressed for time or you're finding the situation to be stressful in some way.
00:23:07.497 --> 00:23:21.380
I know this feels a little bit counterintuitive, but when those are the things that are at play, those are the times when we wanna be even more intentional about focusing on the engagement techniques that work, and using the messaging that goes with them.
00:23:22.046 --> 00:23:24.086
Messaging and engagement are skill sets.
00:23:24.175 --> 00:23:24.955
No question.
00:23:25.266 --> 00:23:31.944
And the thing about a lot of these kinds of approaches, especially like doing your introductions in a totally different way.
00:23:32.275 --> 00:23:40.135
And holding back on giving forth a bunch of information and data, cause you know how powerful it is and you want them to get it.
00:23:40.435 --> 00:23:47.096
But holding back on that and focusing instead on pulling in the emotions, pulling in the engagement, finding those points of alignment.
00:23:47.096 --> 00:23:50.589
And hitting on points of relevance all throughout the conversation.
00:23:51.069 --> 00:23:59.105
Being able to do all of that consistently is a huge key to improving your advocacy results.
00:23:59.286 --> 00:24:04.401
To getting bigger investments from decision makers, to creating better policy.
00:24:04.550 --> 00:24:07.280
Whatever your goals are for working with your decision makers.
00:24:07.520 --> 00:24:12.715
If you want to get them to yes on a more regular basis, these are the strategies that will do it.
00:24:13.016 --> 00:24:15.576
And these are the pitfalls you really gotta watch out for.
00:24:16.076 --> 00:24:17.726
But like I said, they're skills.
00:24:17.875 --> 00:24:26.111
To get really good at them, especially the ones that may feel a little unfamiliar and not business as usual, they take practice.
00:24:26.980 --> 00:24:28.631
They take refinement.
00:24:28.851 --> 00:24:32.871
Most of us don't get it right on the first try, or even the first two or three tries.
00:24:33.030 --> 00:24:34.348
We work our way to it.
00:24:35.068 --> 00:24:38.398
And that's where coaching can be incredibly valuable.
00:24:39.005 --> 00:24:42.845
And on that front I have some news I think you're gonna want to hear.
00:24:43.394 --> 00:24:46.064
I'm about to start a new coaching program in January.
00:24:46.163 --> 00:24:55.354
And in it we're going to be focusing precisely on these two skill sets that are at the heart of the most successful advocacy results you're ever gonna see.
00:24:56.051 --> 00:24:57.132
Now let me be clear.
00:24:57.392 --> 00:25:02.672
The Nonprofit leaders that are drawn to work with me are already doing a lot of things right.
00:25:03.092 --> 00:25:11.192
And honestly, if you weren't already doing quite a few things right in this environment, particularly, you'd probably be outta business right now.
00:25:11.882 --> 00:25:13.981
So it's not about having bad results.
00:25:13.981 --> 00:25:15.092
Your results are good.
00:25:15.662 --> 00:25:29.551
But there's still a level of frustration about decision makers who don't get it, who aren't all in, who aren't really grasping the true value of your work, and they're not excited to invest at the level that reflects that true value.
00:25:30.537 --> 00:25:37.257
In just a few weeks, it's gonna be 2026, and I know that if you're listening, your results are already good.
00:25:38.055 --> 00:25:40.994
My question to you is, would you like them to be better?
00:25:41.595 --> 00:25:52.079
Would you like to move outta the frustration of decision makers not getting it and move into decision makers going all in and getting as excited about your work as you are?
00:25:52.980 --> 00:25:56.579
There is no better time to start than at the beginning of the new year.
00:25:57.329 --> 00:26:12.960
That's why I'm kicking off the new year with a new program that's gonna laser focus on these two skill sets and on coaching a small group of founding members to their next level so that you can start getting next level results with your decision makers.
00:26:13.584 --> 00:26:38.034
I'm limiting this to 10 founding members because I wanna make sure that you're getting exactly what you need and that you're getting the amount of coaching time you need to really grow your skills and to own them so thoroughly that you can take them into your conversations with decision makers, with confidence, and start shifting the results, increasing their level of buy-in and increasing their level of investment.
00:26:38.779 --> 00:26:40.579
The wait list is now open.
00:26:41.224 --> 00:26:46.684
If you want those next level results, I wanna make sure that you get one of those 10 spots.
00:26:47.525 --> 00:26:50.224
Message me on LinkedIn or the podcast website.
00:26:50.255 --> 00:26:51.894
I'll put those in the show notes.
00:26:52.375 --> 00:26:54.445
And let me know to save a spot for you.
00:26:55.259 --> 00:27:00.239
Thanks for listening, and I'll see you in the next episode right here on the Nonprofit Power Podcast.
00:00:00.050 --> 00:00:02.720
You're listening to the Nonprofit Power Podcast.
00:00:03.020 --> 00:00:11.330
In today's episode, we share the three biggest mistakes in messaging and engagement that could be costing you influence and results.
00:00:11.660 --> 00:00:12.109
So stay tuned.
00:00:19.274 --> 00:00:28.184
If you wanna have real and powerful influence over the money and policy decisions that impact your organization and the people you serve, then you're in the right place.
00:00:28.785 --> 00:00:41.804
I'm Kath Patrick, and I've helped dozens of progressive Nonprofit leaders take their organizations to new and higher levels of impact and success by building powerful influence with the decision makers that matter.
00:00:42.435 --> 00:00:54.975
It is possible to get a critical mass of the money and policy decision makers in your world to be as invested in your success as you are, to have them seeking you out as an equal partner and to have them.
00:00:55.034 --> 00:00:57.825
Bringing opportunities and resources to you.
00:00:58.424 --> 00:01:00.554
This podcast will help you do just that.
00:01:01.005 --> 00:01:04.034
Welcome to the Nonprofit Power Podcast.
00:01:09.599 --> 00:01:10.307
Hey there folks.
00:01:10.307 --> 00:01:12.376
Welcome to the Nonprofit Power Podcast.
00:01:12.736 --> 00:01:13.966
I'm your host, Kath Patrick.
00:01:14.507 --> 00:01:41.147
I'm so glad you're here for today's episode because I see three major mistakes that get made all the time among Nonprofit leaders when they're engaging decision makers that will invariably cost you influence and results, especially funding results Now more than ever, especially in this environment, you need your existing funders and potential funders both to be investing in your work at the highest level.
00:01:41.572 --> 00:01:53.581
But lately when you go to talk to elected officials or government agency people or foundations, a lot of the times you hear things like, well, there's not really any money right now.
00:01:53.581 --> 00:01:55.022
We can't afford it.
00:01:55.201 --> 00:01:58.501
It's not the right time, blah, blah, blah.
00:01:58.772 --> 00:02:06.421
And you start to feel like all the stuff you came to tell them that explains why they need to invest is falling on deaf ears.
00:02:07.201 --> 00:02:10.861
They listen politely enough, but you can feel the resistance.
00:02:11.401 --> 00:02:19.622
And every time you have one of these conversations, your frustration goes up another notch and your worry level goes up another notch too.
00:02:19.981 --> 00:02:26.651
'Cause if we can't break through with these people, if we can't get them to get it, where's the money gonna come from?
00:02:26.891 --> 00:02:27.611
And then what?
00:02:28.360 --> 00:02:32.319
It's tempting to write off those decision makers or get mad at them.
00:02:33.189 --> 00:02:37.030
But if we really want their investment, we have to find a way in.
00:02:37.563 --> 00:02:51.783
If they're not getting the most essential pieces of what you do and the problem you solve, and the value that solution has, the impact that it makes, and the level of investment that is necessary in order to buy that impact.
00:02:52.342 --> 00:02:53.932
If they're not getting all of that.
00:02:54.337 --> 00:02:58.008
And feeling motivated to find a way to make that investment.
00:02:58.638 --> 00:03:04.578
Then somewhere your messaging and engagement are not doing as good a job for you as they could.
00:03:05.418 --> 00:03:12.057
Chances are you may be making one or more of three very common and costly mistakes.
00:03:14.122 --> 00:03:21.263
What I see a lot of the time is that these mistakes tend to happen as a combination of messaging and engagement.
00:03:21.735 --> 00:03:29.651
And when that's going on, the signs of the mistakes can be subtle at first, but they tend to build on one another during the conversation.
00:03:30.191 --> 00:03:38.409
And somewhere along the way you realize they're not as engaged as you want them to be, and your best information isn't landing.
00:03:38.710 --> 00:03:39.879
They're not getting it.
00:03:40.419 --> 00:03:45.760
And that's our number one test for, is the messaging and engagement working well?
00:03:46.270 --> 00:03:48.550
It's, are they getting it or aren't they?
00:03:49.474 --> 00:03:56.557
One of the biggest mistakes that will cost you the most, is really insidious because it doesn't feel like that should be so.
00:03:57.057 --> 00:03:59.518
This mistake could be described in a number of ways.
00:03:59.518 --> 00:04:01.617
You could call it business as usual.
00:04:01.617 --> 00:04:04.448
You could call it doing things the way you've always done them.
00:04:05.078 --> 00:04:08.707
You could call it doing things the way everybody else is doing them.
00:04:09.207 --> 00:04:11.397
Any or all of those things can apply.
00:04:11.728 --> 00:04:18.838
It doesn't really matter which one it is, but it's the business as usual problem that can really cost you.
00:04:19.678 --> 00:04:24.168
The essential mistake is opening with information rather than engagement.
00:04:25.038 --> 00:04:32.209
How many times have you walked into a meeting with a decision maker and just kind of launched into your normal introductory spiel?
00:04:32.238 --> 00:04:32.569
Right?
00:04:32.569 --> 00:04:33.619
Introduce yourself.
00:04:33.678 --> 00:04:35.778
If you've brought anyone with you, you introduce them.
00:04:35.988 --> 00:04:42.584
And then you go into kind of the background paragraph or two about what you do, who you help, how many people you serve and so on.
00:04:43.360 --> 00:04:48.341
And that's really comfortable and familiar'cause you've done it a million times.
00:04:48.341 --> 00:04:53.189
It feels like a good idea because it's helping you relax.
00:04:53.189 --> 00:05:01.620
It's helping you get into the meeting and kind of get your rhythm going, get in the flow of talking to this particular decision maker.
00:05:01.889 --> 00:05:06.711
Especially if there's anything about this conversation that's feeling maybe a little stressful going in.
00:05:07.341 --> 00:05:23.163
It's very natural to wanna focus on some very comfortable and familiar messaging that you've said a million times so you don't have to think too hard about it, and that you can kind of use that opportunity to breathe and relax into the flow of the conversation.
00:05:23.884 --> 00:05:26.673
So that seems like a totally reasonable thing to do.
00:05:27.297 --> 00:05:28.257
Here's the problem.
00:05:28.757 --> 00:05:30.617
There's nothing about that that's engaging.
00:05:31.117 --> 00:05:37.177
How many times have you sat through somebody else's introduction that kind of goes on for a paragraph or two.
00:05:37.607 --> 00:05:41.507
Hopefully you're focused on trying to remember their name and the organization they're from.
00:05:41.716 --> 00:05:46.367
But after that, you know, unless it's super interesting, your mind's probably wandering.
00:05:46.367 --> 00:05:51.302
You're maybe thinking about the next thing you need to say, or wondering where this is going or whatever.
00:05:51.543 --> 00:05:52.862
But you're not engaged.
00:05:53.418 --> 00:05:57.468
At the very best, you are politely, but passively listening.
00:05:58.211 --> 00:06:02.232
Is that really what you want from a decision maker is polite, passive, listening?
00:06:02.891 --> 00:06:05.831
We want them engaged from the very beginning.
00:06:06.701 --> 00:06:10.091
So if we want that, we can't do business as usual.
00:06:10.591 --> 00:06:17.252
And you know, we think that it doesn't matter if we start out with the boring basics,'cause like everybody understands that's how it goes.
00:06:17.252 --> 00:06:20.461
And you have to get through that part before you get to the interesting stuff.
00:06:21.132 --> 00:06:22.752
I invite you to rethink that.
00:06:23.427 --> 00:06:25.875
Because think about, what's gonna engage you?
00:06:26.355 --> 00:06:30.555
If somebody's yammering at you about what their organization does and who they help and blah, blah, blah.
00:06:31.103 --> 00:06:36.533
And especially if they're doing it in a way that you can tell, they've said this a kabillion times before.
00:06:36.983 --> 00:06:39.593
How closely are you listening to that quite honestly?
00:06:40.163 --> 00:06:43.973
I can promise you that decision makers tend not to listen super closely to that.
00:06:44.293 --> 00:06:45.372
Polite listening, yes.
00:06:45.372 --> 00:06:46.692
But are they really engaging?
00:06:46.783 --> 00:06:47.083
No.
00:06:47.882 --> 00:06:57.052
And the problem is that, it actually does matter if we start out with those boring basics, because boring basics create distance.
00:06:57.742 --> 00:06:59.182
They create disengagement.
00:06:59.483 --> 00:07:00.173
You've seen this.
00:07:00.173 --> 00:07:03.773
Decision makers are already somewhat predisposed to be disengaged.
00:07:04.512 --> 00:07:05.923
So we have to change that.
00:07:06.766 --> 00:07:09.646
Now, you may not be able to escape introductions.
00:07:09.797 --> 00:07:14.146
If you've not met with this person before, or if some in your group have not met with them before.
00:07:14.627 --> 00:07:18.036
They do need to know who's in the room, so you have to go ahead and do that.
00:07:18.595 --> 00:07:20.605
But even with that simple thing.
00:07:21.105 --> 00:07:26.444
Which I know it's so tempting to just be rote with that and just be like, yep, i'm Suzy Q.
00:07:26.475 --> 00:07:31.701
I'm the CEO of X, Y, Z organization, and we do this, that, and the other.
00:07:32.495 --> 00:07:36.785
Instead of doing it the way you've always done it and the way everybody else is doing it.
00:07:37.309 --> 00:07:45.899
Try doing it in a way that helps you stand out, that helps you grab the decision maker's attention from the very first words outta your mouth.
00:07:46.673 --> 00:08:08.963
So instead of saying, I'm Suzy Q, I'm the CEO of X, Y, Z organization, and we do blah, blah, blah, you could say, i'm Suzy Q and I'm lucky enough to be the CEO of the one organization in this community that transforms, fill in the blank, whatever the impact is you make on the people you serve.
00:08:09.463 --> 00:08:14.252
And don't be afraid to make your organization distinct in that process.
00:08:14.882 --> 00:08:18.122
The name of your organization doesn't necessarily mean anything to them.
00:08:18.543 --> 00:08:23.367
Unless they know you really well already, in which case you're not having an introductory conversation.
00:08:24.117 --> 00:08:25.026
But if they don't know that.
00:08:25.526 --> 00:08:30.987
Or even if they think they do, even if they think they know what you do, and this happens a lot by the way.
00:08:31.497 --> 00:08:32.756
Oh yeah, I know.
00:08:32.756 --> 00:08:34.256
X, Y, Z organization.
00:08:34.527 --> 00:08:35.726
They work on.
00:08:35.907 --> 00:08:40.976
And then they'll say something and it's like kind of tangentially related to what you do.
00:08:41.397 --> 00:08:50.442
But it is so far from understanding the depth of the problems you solve and the depth of the impact you make, that it's kind of horrifying.
00:08:50.892 --> 00:08:55.812
So even when they think they know your organization, they probably don't unless they've actually worked with you.
00:08:56.711 --> 00:09:01.981
So yeah, you need to say the name of the organization, but you don't need to say it first.
00:09:02.461 --> 00:09:14.408
Lead with the impact and say, I'm lucky enough to be the CEO of an organization that is unique in this community, in the way that we make a powerful impact on whoever you serve.
00:09:14.977 --> 00:09:17.918
And we transform their lives in X, Y, Z ways.
00:09:18.458 --> 00:09:20.678
And you get that in there right at the beginning.
00:09:21.033 --> 00:09:22.823
Now you're sparking curiosity.
00:09:22.823 --> 00:09:26.364
Now you're sparking, oh wait, hey, maybe I should pay attention to this.
00:09:26.413 --> 00:09:31.134
If they're making a big impact in the community and they're unique in some way, I might wanna know about that.
00:09:31.953 --> 00:09:42.864
What we have to realize is that each time you open your mouth, it's a tiny opportunity to build engagement, to build interest, to build curiosity.
00:09:43.364 --> 00:09:52.904
It's also, each time you open your mouth, an opportunity to have them push away a little bit, to have them disengage just a little bit more.
00:09:53.715 --> 00:10:01.658
So, of course, the choice we wanna make is, each time we open our mouth, we wanna make sure we're doing the engaging thing.
00:10:01.658 --> 00:10:05.938
And that we're using the messaging elements that are going to help cause that engagement.
00:10:06.785 --> 00:10:16.494
Another mistake that I see happen a lot is waiting too long in the conversation to show alignment and relevance to the things that they care about.
00:10:16.994 --> 00:10:27.070
And a lot of times I'll see Nonprofit leaders give their whole spiel and then at the end they'll say, and this is how that's all aligned with the the stuff that you care about.
00:10:27.570 --> 00:10:38.193
You can imagine that when we do that, we're leaving a big element of influence on the table for most of the conversation when we could be leveraging it at every moment.
00:10:38.977 --> 00:10:49.727
The thing is that a lot of times, even when we do get around to highlighting alignment and relevance, we tend to do it in kind of dry factual ways.
00:10:50.538 --> 00:10:58.977
And just like all our other messaging, if we want it to engage, we need to evoke emotion, we need to involve the senses.
00:10:59.128 --> 00:11:02.538
We need to inspire curiosity and thought.
00:11:02.807 --> 00:11:05.508
We need to do all the stuff we need to do with all the rest of our messaging.
00:11:06.561 --> 00:11:12.140
It's not that we do that for part of it, like for the client story, and then we don't do that for all the other.
00:11:12.321 --> 00:11:13.520
We do it for everything.
00:11:14.248 --> 00:11:19.714
So really, points of alignment and relevance between your stuff and the decision-maker's.
00:11:19.714 --> 00:11:24.953
Interests, ideally are being woven in from the very beginning of the conversation.
00:11:25.453 --> 00:11:29.014
And the more you can incorporate points of relevance, the better.
00:11:29.600 --> 00:11:34.995
It's not just, you know, I'll take a super common example'cause it's really simple and happens a lot.
00:11:35.525 --> 00:11:37.985
You've got somebody who is very fiscally conservative.
00:11:38.035 --> 00:11:41.125
Or maybe they're not even fiscally conservative, but they're worried about the budget.
00:11:41.711 --> 00:11:44.846
And you're asking them to make a bigger investment.
00:11:45.346 --> 00:11:49.517
So you've already planned, you're gonna come in and you're gonna hit hard on the ROI data.
00:11:49.846 --> 00:11:56.417
And you're gonna talk to them about the ripple effects you make and how that offsets other costs, other outlays, et cetera.
00:11:56.417 --> 00:11:58.307
You've put together that rationale.
00:11:58.817 --> 00:11:59.116
Right.
00:11:59.447 --> 00:12:00.047
So that's good.
00:12:00.047 --> 00:12:01.397
You want that, you need that.
00:12:01.397 --> 00:12:05.735
That's the underpinning of the factual part of your messaging.
00:12:06.634 --> 00:12:11.664
But how we roll that out, how we use that in conversation, really matters.
00:12:12.648 --> 00:12:28.831
One of the most effective ways to do that is to think of, ideally before the meeting, all the different ways in which any aspect of your stuff is relevant to any aspect of things they care about.
00:12:29.466 --> 00:12:33.267
And you're pulling up those points of relevance at every opportunity.
00:12:33.928 --> 00:12:36.658
Let me take that same example and build that out a little bit.
00:12:37.158 --> 00:12:46.541
We need to bring to life for them the full experience of being in the problem that they're in, that is causing there to be alignment.
00:12:46.806 --> 00:12:52.255
Or being in the experience of not having the thing that they want, that is the ultimate outcome they're after, whatever it is.
00:12:52.816 --> 00:13:03.255
Or maybe it's a positive experience of, they have a big ambition to make something great happen, and your stuff is aligned in some way.
00:13:03.525 --> 00:13:04.186
Either way.
00:13:04.365 --> 00:13:07.725
But a lot of times it's really about them being in a problem.
00:13:08.176 --> 00:13:10.456
Like there's not enough money in the budget.
00:13:10.966 --> 00:13:12.316
And they're really stressed.
00:13:12.395 --> 00:13:23.635
Elected officials right now, at every level of government, but particularly state and local governments are just really stressed out about the fact that revenue is down in a lot of places.
00:13:24.385 --> 00:13:31.255
And their standard playbook for what you do when you have a shortfall in revenue is one of two things.
00:13:31.375 --> 00:13:37.062
You either raise taxes, you increase the revenue, or you reduce expenses.
00:13:37.611 --> 00:13:41.422
And there's already a critical flaw in that thinking.
00:13:41.721 --> 00:13:54.461
There's actually several, but the one that is the most dangerous to you is if you allow them to view investment in your program as an expense, versus an investment.
00:13:54.711 --> 00:13:56.871
That's a critical reframe that has to happen.
00:13:56.961 --> 00:14:03.081
Because as long as they think of you as an outlay, like, oh, it's a thing we have to spend money on, and it just sort of goes away.
00:14:03.081 --> 00:14:06.442
We spend on it and it's gone, and there's not really a return.
00:14:06.942 --> 00:14:12.611
If you have any ROI data or framing at all, which I hope you do.
00:14:13.162 --> 00:14:17.331
Then you're talking to them about the ways in which this is an investment.
00:14:17.971 --> 00:14:21.991
But let's just bring this back'cause it's going a little couple different places here.
00:14:22.491 --> 00:14:25.111
If they're in the problem of from their perspective.
00:14:25.361 --> 00:14:28.511
The way they would describe the problem is there's not enough money.
00:14:29.032 --> 00:14:32.998
The revenue we have this year is less than the revenue we had last year.
00:14:33.508 --> 00:14:37.975
And our commitments to spend money on stuff hasn't gone down.
00:14:38.475 --> 00:14:40.695
There's still all these things that we need to spend money on.
00:14:41.195 --> 00:14:45.245
That's a very stressful position for them to be in, especially for elected officials.
00:14:45.605 --> 00:14:47.404
Because none of that's popular.
00:14:47.615 --> 00:14:49.835
If they have to raise taxes, that will be unpopular.
00:14:49.955 --> 00:14:53.524
If they have to reduce services, that will be unpopular.
00:14:54.034 --> 00:14:57.544
They're between a rock and a hard place as far as they can see it.
00:14:58.044 --> 00:15:05.154
So one thing for you to do is to think about, what does it feel like to be in that problem?
00:15:05.654 --> 00:15:07.215
How stressful is that?
00:15:07.904 --> 00:15:23.815
Depending on their general political bent, maybe they're somebody who really cares about the broad array of social services and is really torn up, really upset about the possibility that some of those services might have to be cut.
00:15:24.024 --> 00:15:25.554
From the way they're thinking right now.
00:15:25.804 --> 00:15:33.514
At the same time, they're looking at the possibility of trying to raise taxes and realizing how unpopular that would be and how much blowback there would be.
00:15:33.514 --> 00:15:35.615
And that that would be a whole thing.
00:15:35.717 --> 00:15:37.638
That's a very stressful place to be.
00:15:37.937 --> 00:15:46.418
So the more you can acknowledge what that feels like to be in that problem, to talk about some of the stress and the distress.
00:15:46.837 --> 00:15:51.357
If they're worried about possibly having to cut services they really care about and so on.
00:15:51.778 --> 00:15:59.820
To be able to speak to what that feels like and to show them that you get it, you get what they're going through, you understand them.
00:16:00.370 --> 00:16:07.080
And then to be able to talk about how there's actually a third way.
00:16:07.580 --> 00:16:13.279
That it's not just raise more revenue or reduce expenses.
00:16:13.779 --> 00:16:16.720
The third option is to invest wisely.
00:16:17.220 --> 00:16:31.176
And when you invest wisely in a program or service that actually reduces expenses somewhere else on the ledger, that that becomes a much more productive and interesting investment.
00:16:31.176 --> 00:16:41.750
That actually starts to not only still be able to carry out the important services, but actually to reduce the outlay in some other places.
00:16:42.250 --> 00:16:47.221
Because if you solve the problem, then the continuous outlay goes away.
00:16:48.120 --> 00:17:02.958
So there's a bunch of different ways to talk about that, that are both successful messaging in terms of framing the investment in your work as an investment rather than an expense, which is critical framing always, but especially now.
00:17:03.769 --> 00:17:09.378
But the other piece of it is to not be afraid to spend some time.
00:17:09.469 --> 00:17:14.051
You don't have to go super deep, but to spend some time acknowledging.
00:17:14.321 --> 00:17:18.142
Saying, you know, it's gotta be a really stressful situation for you all.
00:17:18.192 --> 00:17:20.291
You care about social services, if they do.
00:17:20.442 --> 00:17:23.142
Or you can say you care about being fiscally responsible.
00:17:23.172 --> 00:17:24.882
Whatever the thing is that they care about.
00:17:25.182 --> 00:17:28.132
And you've got what feels like an impossible situation.
00:17:28.632 --> 00:17:31.872
And then you can present your solution to their problem.
00:17:32.298 --> 00:17:33.917
Which is the wise investment.
00:17:34.718 --> 00:17:36.157
That's just one example.
00:17:36.843 --> 00:17:43.952
What would happen if you had that strategy lined up, but you waited to lay it out till the end, when you're making your ask?
00:17:44.643 --> 00:17:52.863
How much opportunity for engagement would've been lost And what would happen if you did something different?
00:17:53.397 --> 00:17:59.907
How much more predisposed to take in everything you're saying and to wanna help and wanna invest.
00:18:00.448 --> 00:18:18.137
How much more likely would they be to be saying yes to all of that if you had connected with their emotional experience of the problem very early in the conversation and helped them to see that you've come to help them get out of that very painful problem.
00:18:19.007 --> 00:18:22.750
This applies to whatever the variables are at hand.
00:18:22.750 --> 00:18:24.911
That's just one example that's very common.
00:18:25.615 --> 00:18:36.566
But to acknowledge their emotional experience of the thing that they are either struggling with or that they are hoping to achieve but can't see a way to yet.
00:18:37.162 --> 00:18:46.768
If you just sit with them for a bit and reflect back to them the emotional aspects of that experience, you're gonna connect with them on a whole new level.
00:18:46.768 --> 00:18:50.038
And they're gonna look at you and hear you in a very different way.
00:18:50.538 --> 00:18:57.428
And since we're all about engagement, the more engaged they are, the more of your messaging they take in and retain.
00:18:58.265 --> 00:19:08.519
Now, the third huge super common mistake that I see every single Nonprofit leader do at least once during the time I work with them.
00:19:09.176 --> 00:19:12.287
And that is overreliance on information.
00:19:13.044 --> 00:19:16.086
And I get why leaders do this.
00:19:16.336 --> 00:19:19.037
Part of this is the curse of being the expert.
00:19:19.498 --> 00:19:30.196
We know so much about the work that we do, and the complexity of it and the depth of impact it makes, and the incredible value that that creates and the worth of that investment.
00:19:30.390 --> 00:19:37.462
We get all of that so deeply that when we're talking with a decision maker and they're not getting it.
00:19:37.962 --> 00:19:43.573
We tend to think that the reason they're not getting it, is that we didn't explain it enough.
00:19:43.573 --> 00:19:45.103
We didn't give them enough detail.
00:19:45.153 --> 00:19:45.873
Oh, well wait.
00:19:45.923 --> 00:19:50.272
Maybe I left out the part where this is an important thing they need to know, da, da, da.
00:19:50.542 --> 00:19:51.952
And I'll, I'll put that in.
00:19:51.952 --> 00:19:55.853
I'll give them more data, I'll give them more information, and then they'll get it.
00:19:56.873 --> 00:20:02.920
Once in a blue moon, the problem is actually that they were missing a piece of information.
00:20:02.920 --> 00:20:03.970
That does happen.
00:20:04.661 --> 00:20:15.411
It is possible, and I'm guilty of this on a regular basis, that when we are deeply knowledgeable about something, we'll often make a mental leap and leave others behind when we do that.
00:20:15.861 --> 00:20:20.480
So we need to structure our messaging in a way that has us not doing that.
00:20:21.030 --> 00:20:24.314
But usually that's not really why they're not getting it.
00:20:25.104 --> 00:20:31.731
Usually the reason they're not getting it is that they're not emotionally invested in the stuff.
00:20:32.231 --> 00:20:34.751
They're not listening that hard, so it doesn't matter.
00:20:35.358 --> 00:20:36.348
So here's a question.
00:20:36.499 --> 00:20:49.249
If they're already not listening very hard and you give them more data, more facts, more information, what are the chances that they will listen harder because you're giving them more of the thing they're already not listening to?
00:20:50.377 --> 00:21:10.284
We make the mistake of thinking that decision makers are operating principally from the rational side of the brain, when in fact they're like every other human on the planet and the emotional center is running most of the show Now they will deny that till the cows come home.
00:21:10.959 --> 00:21:12.278
But it doesn't matter.
00:21:12.308 --> 00:21:15.249
They're humans and that's how our brains are wired.
00:21:15.608 --> 00:21:19.565
So the fact is, we must engage the emotions.
00:21:19.565 --> 00:21:22.231
We must engage the whole human.
00:21:22.682 --> 00:21:23.791
We need to connect.
00:21:24.362 --> 00:21:29.059
And we can impart information along the way.
00:21:29.390 --> 00:21:33.554
But even when we're doing that, the best way to do it is to ask questions.
00:21:33.554 --> 00:21:37.592
To invite them to think for themselves about what's the next thing?
00:21:37.855 --> 00:21:42.259
What's the next piece of this logic framework or whatever that you're bringing them along with.
00:21:43.220 --> 00:21:46.950
Ask questions, inspire curiosity, create surprise.
00:21:47.450 --> 00:21:50.339
You can also inspire other emotions.
00:21:50.339 --> 00:21:51.509
You can evoke the senses.
00:21:51.509 --> 00:21:56.659
You can do all the things with different stories, with different pieces of messaging.
00:21:57.290 --> 00:22:03.811
But the deadly mistake is making the assumption that if they're not getting it, that what they need is more information.
00:22:04.749 --> 00:22:06.398
It's almost never true.
00:22:07.199 --> 00:22:10.910
So three big mistakes and what to do instead.
00:22:11.482 --> 00:22:13.227
Let's just recap real briefly.
00:22:13.727 --> 00:22:18.999
Three big mistakes are opening with information rather than engagement.
00:22:19.499 --> 00:22:25.078
Waiting too long in the conversation to show alignment and relevance to the things they care about.
00:22:25.578 --> 00:22:34.884
And relying primarily on information to fill knowledge gaps when the problem is that they're actually just not listening because they're not engaged.
00:22:35.634 --> 00:22:40.454
If you can pay attention to those three major pitfalls and can stay out of them.
00:22:40.923 --> 00:22:47.997
And can instead deliberately craft your messaging and engagement strategy to fix those three pieces.
00:22:48.497 --> 00:22:52.997
The level of engagement that you see from decision makers will go up very quickly.
00:22:53.497 --> 00:23:00.217
And if you're already doing this most of the time, pay attention to where you tend to fall back into the pitfalls.
00:23:00.636 --> 00:23:06.846
Chances are it's when you're either super pressed for time or you're finding the situation to be stressful in some way.
00:23:07.497 --> 00:23:21.380
I know this feels a little bit counterintuitive, but when those are the things that are at play, those are the times when we wanna be even more intentional about focusing on the engagement techniques that work, and using the messaging that goes with them.
00:23:22.046 --> 00:23:24.086
Messaging and engagement are skill sets.
00:23:24.175 --> 00:23:24.955
No question.
00:23:25.266 --> 00:23:31.944
And the thing about a lot of these kinds of approaches, especially like doing your introductions in a totally different way.
00:23:32.275 --> 00:23:40.135
And holding back on giving forth a bunch of information and data, cause you know how powerful it is and you want them to get it.
00:23:40.435 --> 00:23:47.096
But holding back on that and focusing instead on pulling in the emotions, pulling in the engagement, finding those points of alignment.
00:23:47.096 --> 00:23:50.589
And hitting on points of relevance all throughout the conversation.
00:23:51.069 --> 00:23:59.105
Being able to do all of that consistently is a huge key to improving your advocacy results.
00:23:59.286 --> 00:24:04.401
To getting bigger investments from decision makers, to creating better policy.
00:24:04.550 --> 00:24:07.280
Whatever your goals are for working with your decision makers.
00:24:07.520 --> 00:24:12.715
If you want to get them to yes on a more regular basis, these are the strategies that will do it.
00:24:13.016 --> 00:24:15.576
And these are the pitfalls you really gotta watch out for.
00:24:16.076 --> 00:24:17.726
But like I said, they're skills.
00:24:17.875 --> 00:24:26.111
To get really good at them, especially the ones that may feel a little unfamiliar and not business as usual, they take practice.
00:24:26.980 --> 00:24:28.631
They take refinement.
00:24:28.851 --> 00:24:32.871
Most of us don't get it right on the first try, or even the first two or three tries.
00:24:33.030 --> 00:24:34.348
We work our way to it.
00:24:35.068 --> 00:24:38.398
And that's where coaching can be incredibly valuable.
00:24:39.005 --> 00:24:42.845
And on that front I have some news I think you're gonna want to hear.
00:24:43.394 --> 00:24:46.064
I'm about to start a new coaching program in January.
00:24:46.163 --> 00:24:55.354
And in it we're going to be focusing precisely on these two skill sets that are at the heart of the most successful advocacy results you're ever gonna see.
00:24:56.051 --> 00:24:57.132
Now let me be clear.
00:24:57.392 --> 00:25:02.672
The Nonprofit leaders that are drawn to work with me are already doing a lot of things right.
00:25:03.092 --> 00:25:11.192
And honestly, if you weren't already doing quite a few things right in this environment, particularly, you'd probably be outta business right now.
00:25:11.882 --> 00:25:13.981
So it's not about having bad results.
00:25:13.981 --> 00:25:15.092
Your results are good.
00:25:15.662 --> 00:25:29.551
But there's still a level of frustration about decision makers who don't get it, who aren't all in, who aren't really grasping the true value of your work, and they're not excited to invest at the level that reflects that true value.
00:25:30.537 --> 00:25:37.257
In just a few weeks, it's gonna be 2026, and I know that if you're listening, your results are already good.
00:25:38.055 --> 00:25:40.994
My question to you is, would you like them to be better?
00:25:41.595 --> 00:25:52.079
Would you like to move outta the frustration of decision makers not getting it and move into decision makers going all in and getting as excited about your work as you are?
00:25:52.980 --> 00:25:56.579
There is no better time to start than at the beginning of the new year.
00:25:57.329 --> 00:26:12.960
That's why I'm kicking off the new year with a new program that's gonna laser focus on these two skill sets and on coaching a small group of founding members to their next level so that you can start getting next level results with your decision makers.
00:26:13.584 --> 00:26:38.034
I'm limiting this to 10 founding members because I wanna make sure that you're getting exactly what you need and that you're getting the amount of coaching time you need to really grow your skills and to own them so thoroughly that you can take them into your conversations with decision makers, with confidence, and start shifting the results, increasing their level of buy-in and increasing their level of investment.
00:26:38.779 --> 00:26:40.579
The wait list is now open.
00:26:41.224 --> 00:26:46.684
If you want those next level results, I wanna make sure that you get one of those 10 spots.
00:26:47.525 --> 00:26:50.224
Message me on LinkedIn or the podcast website.
00:26:50.255 --> 00:26:51.894
I'll put those in the show notes.
00:26:52.375 --> 00:26:54.445
And let me know to save a spot for you.
00:26:55.259 --> 00:27:00.239
Thanks for listening, and I'll see you in the next episode right here on the Nonprofit Power Podcast.
